Oh OH …here it comes…

Kelly says:

Re:Already posted
Oh but you omit some important facts – he was tasered multiple times after being handcuffed by four men. I guess four grown men with lots of physical experience with bad boys could not handle what one report said was a slightly built student, so they tasered him. They did the professional thing, I guess, or perhaps the police were much smaller than the student, and built like munchkins or something. A taser would surely have been in order in such a case. And you omit the fact the student was heading out for the door and was tasered only after objecting to being touched.

Kelly says:

Re:How Many Times?
I’ve never been arrested, so your theory behind what you call my “uninformed venom” falls apart.

For certain kinds of people, seeing someone express strong objections to injustice, becuase it is simply wrong, especially when it is based on massive state power, is what is really unfathomable.

What makes people like you, I wonder, support excess violence of the strong and well-funded against the weak and vulnerable? Since you openly speculate about the possible influence of my being arrested, I feel free to openly speculate about your childhood: what happened to you as a kid to make you approve or support electrocuting a kid with a taser – a potentially deadly device, according to an LA Times article – for a minor offense? Must have been exceptionally brutal, and perhaps “the only reason I can fathom for your uninformed venom.”

My rhetorical device of mentioning police with guns is obviously above your head, so I won’t bother asking to read the whole post, and more carefully. If you did, you’d be hard put accusing me of being uninformed. Look in the mirror if you want to see where the venom actually originates from.

Kelly says:

UCLA student stunned by Taser plans suit
The tasered college student has a heavy duty civil rights attorney and is suing UCLA for police brutality. I hope he gets a bundle:

UCLA student stunned by Taser plans suit
http://www.latimes.com/news/printedition/californi a/la-me-ucla17nov17,1,4599352.story?coll=la-headli nes-pe-california

Kelly says:

Re:Already posted
So Greg, let me get this straight: in your relating to kids – if you did have kids and the nieces/nephews you do have – involves not only love but fear, maybe even more – lots more – of the latter. I think I’m beginning to perceive the nature of the kind of mindset you represent.

You don’t have to worry about my kids, as I have none, as far as I know, that is, no potential mother has told about any.

Kelly says:

Re:How Many Times?
Glad to hear you had a blissful childhood, truly, as I wonder how much it would have affected the world in a certain direction if you didn’t, given the sympathies you have expressed against this kid. (Read Joe Stalin’s biography: now his was a very unhappy childhood, and look at what he did to the world, especially after he got, one assumes, “more realistic.”)

In any case, one also hopes you never over-reacted to any of your problem people and criminals, however understandably tempted you might have been, when you were in the police.

As I said in other posts, I’ve seen and witnessed close-up some very bad police, and I heard terrible stories of bad ones from family members in the police. Bad police don’t get winnowed out, they merely join another department. Unless they manage to get jailed.

However, you misrepresent the facts again: this kid was not only tasered – not a very blissful experience, unlike your chidlhood – he was tasered five times, four after he was cuffed, and four men were involved. Now perhaps from your lengthy police experience you can expertly explain why 4 highly trained and experienced cops felt compelled to direct taser charges one and four times against a scrawny kid who was cuffed and limp most of the time. If you can explain this well, then you may possibly have a good argument against me. But what would cops do in such a situation in the old, pre-taser days? I suspect pick the kid up, after cuffing him, and carry him away. They could not do that here? Why?

You said somewhere the taser is not a punitive device, it is rather used to faciliate an arrest. You can only say that about the first tasering, before he was cuffed. But given your experience, how can you claim the taser was not punitive when he was tasered four times after being cuffed? Have you ever been tasered? According to an account at Huff Post, a cocky cop volunteered to be tasered and he was completely immobile for at least 3 minutes, and he was a tough, macho guy. Other people have been reported to take longer to recover. So when this kid would not get up, they blasted him again. Not punitive, huh? Looks plenty damn punitive to me, given he was well in their custody and hand-cuffed and in a state of weakness from the first taser.

And yes, I do recall “they did not shoot him, they did not beat him, they did not kick him, nor punch him.” But my reply is that *you* should remember the kid was not drunk or high and crazy, he was not harassing or bothering anybody, he wasn’t ripping anybody off or invading their space or assaulting them or displaying a weapon, etc., etc. If this were the case and the cops pulled a taser more than once on him after resisting arrest, there would be no story here. All he did was utter loud objections when the police came and touched him. For this he did not deserve 5 zaps from a taser; this was an unjustified assault on him. If I tasered multiple times every person who yelled at me (oh I admit, I would have been tempted to do so against folks even more obnoxious than this kid – even uncooperative wacked-out patients) when I was a hospital cop, I’d end up in jail, and rightfully so.

I believe you when you say you don’t condone police abuse, but if this accounting of the facts does turn out to be decisively true, you’ll be caught defending the indefensible.

Kelly says:

Re:UCLA student stunned by Taser plans suit
Non-whites should follow the rules, of course. But as has been the case with black friends of mine, he likely has suffered from prior bigoted actions and harassment based on his skin color or look over the course of years, and so now he’s become a little over-sensitive quick on the draw. Understandable. If racism in the US went away, so would such paranoia.

Kelly says:

Re:How Many Times?
“And as far as I’m concerned he deserved at least one shot of juice just for blaming it all on the Patriot Act.”

Really? You really mean this, or would you care to take it back?

Sad to say, I suspect you do mean it. What you are saying here is that you are willing to hurt someone, physically harm them, cause them pain and suffering, without due process or law, because they *merely* *said* something you disagreed with, whether it was wrong or not, and said under significant duress. For you, mere words expressing ideas you don’t like truly and really and absolutely warrant swift physical punishment, without a court. I would not wish that on anybody, not even you or the loathsome Oxycontin Limbaugh or Sex Talker O’Reilly. And you work as a librarian in America?!

This statement of yours clearly reveals you as having a fascistic, perhaps even violent mindset more than anything else you have said in this and other debates. You’d do well for yourself to say you were just joking, even if you weren’t. I now see more clearly why your nieces/nephews, as you said yourself, in part perceive you as a scary guy: you are. Oh, I know, they love ya too. Which reminds me: the people “loved” Joe Stalin too, but they were also very frightened of him. Love/fear: a typically response to bullies everywhere.